J. Brown recently popped this blog post onto my Facebook feed with the comment: where is the line between yoga and porn?
He’s a thoughtful guy. I’ve been reading his essays for years, and I tend to agree with most of what he says. I also like that he’s a reformed show-offer and honest about it.
Sounds like someone I know. Cough cough.
Which is probably why I like him. If you are a new reader, you may not have seen my video response to the Equinox yoga video he references. I think I’m hilarious, personally. My boyfriend interrupting my yoga? More hilarious. I’ve also talked about whether doing flashy sh*t gives the wrong impression of yoga.
Bernadette Birney put it wonderfully when she said that some poses come easy to her (like splits/hanumanasana) and are therefore not advanced, for her. Or even show-offy. They are just things she can do with her body.
She does do a beautiful Monkey Pose (yup, that’s what Hanumanasana translates as. Well, OK, Hanuman The Monkey Pose. Whatevs).
I totally get it.
I didn’t have to try particularly hard to do the splits either.
Really old photo, nothing I can do about the smallness, I’m afraid. I’m a bit more open these days & my pelvis sits at a ‘cleaner’ angle.
I can generally do the splits cold, even on stiff hip days.
But Warrior Pose? Supposedly an easier pose?
I struggle with that every day.
The splits is the kind of pose that intimidates beginners into not trying yoga, Warrior Pose is not.
I get that, and I agree with J. Brown that it’s silly to alienate people with the scary poses.
I TOTALLY agree with Bernadette Birney that being good at yoga poses doesn’t necessarily make you good at YOGA.
Yoga being the practice of coming into union with yourself, clearing away the things that darken your heart, and generally becoming a nicer, happier person.
I also totally believe that these glamour shots of gorgeous people doing yoga in their underwear (or even in tight yoga pants) reach a wider audience than the ones of people sitting cross-legged on a rock. I know this, because I inadvertently stumbled on a creepy blog post the other day. The author was pretending to talk business but was really just sleazing over girls in yoga pants. I felt like I need a shower after reading it. That’s why no link. Ew.
But, that’s an audience who would not otherwise be interested in yoga. And if the possibility of seeing a girl in yoga pants gets a bloke to yoga class, and then he discovers he actually likes yoga, does it matter what got him there?
Thoughts?
Moving from Stability: Understanding the Pelvis in Posture (Online workshop)
Light Up Your Life
Wow, such an interesting discussion! Nadine, thanks for providing the space for all this! This reminds me of the “naked yoga ads” hullabaloo a few years back. Some viewers interpreted the photos as artistic, inspirational portraits of the human body in its purest form. Others saw the photos as exploitative. Some women viewers felt empowered by the images of a woman doing an incredibly difficult arm balance with apparent grace and ease. Other women felt that the photos objectified the female body for the sake of selling a product. The discussion got very heated – but ultimately
I guess what I’m trying to say is, so much of truth is in the eye of the beholder (and the attitude of the demonstrator!), and it’s hard to draw lines in the sand around these things because they are so subjective. Everyone’s triggers are different. When I was just starting out and I’d see my teachers or fellow students doing poses that were way out of my reach, I would feel inspired. But in those early days, a deep hip-opener could reduce me to a seething ball of self-loathing.
At the end of the day, it’s so subjective. People see a beautiful woman in an “advanced” yoga pose and call it “porn”. But a photo of a beautiful woman doing an advanced yoga pose with a prosthetic leg is inspirational. And the photos of naked MEN doing yoga? They never even get mentioned. In any case, I think our role as yoga teachers and practitioners is to help each other navigate our own subjectivity, create a safe space for discussing both sides of the issue, and help each person find both their edge and their place of awareness around the debate.
Sex sells, so the saying goes. It’s true, each person has his/her boundary lines. This kind of objectifying goes on in the art world ad nauseum, but God forbid anyone objects. That makes you a weird person. Oh well.
agree Nadine re achieving difficult or seemingly once impossible poses personally (and finding ease in them) is grounds for strength and courage for when going about the rest of our life.
J. Brown: All asana have merit when utilised appropriately? I am in total agreement
. I figure that if someone has hurt themselves (and I have done this) either they, or their teacher, or both, were not in a yogic space.
And amphibi1yogini, thanks for the clarification. Sound like you are still doing yoga, just in different movement forms
@J Brown, a.k.a., finding your “edge” (if that is a necessary part – never a sufficient part – of your practice. Engaging the parasympathetic nervous system and centering oneself is the sufficient part, to me) in the most fundamental of poses. Holding an awkward chair pose for a dozen slow, mindful and aware breaths.
Challenge does not have just the vertical dimension. It very much can have the lateral dimension.
That said, I did hurt myself attempting inversions. Better to have stayed for many breaths with my feet still on the ground. Even if forever. The object not being accomplishment.
Accomplishments are non-accomplishments.
Nadine- When an asana hurts someone, does it still have merit? The usual line would be “injuries are teachers.” But I have hard time accepting that yoga practice is meant to teach us through injuries. Perhaps we could amend it just a bit to: “All asana have merit when utilized appropriately.” Of course, what is appropriate is open to interpretation. Also, cultivating persistence, practice and dedication does not require challenging physicality. Such things can be brought about through simple, non-achievement oriented practice just the same. And often, with a lot less trouble along the way. Having said that, I really appreciate the conversation as well. Kudos.
@nadinefawell, I have been practicing yoga regularly for 5 years. I discovered online yoga download sites. Since I am a little on in years, the relatively vigorous but forgiving style of yoga I practice may not be the best for my aging body. Certain yoga studios that have attracted me and my kind, have morphed into supernovae (cf., OM Yoga Center). In any event, I have branched out to include the dancing path (with some pilates thrown in) …I am inspired to dance a lot of the time.
Whatever works..
It was either do these things, or give up yoga entirely.
What an interesting conversation, everyone! Thanks for weighing in. amphibi1yogini , I’d be interested to hear more on why you aren’t practicing much any more? And there is no requirement to turn vegan, or ever do the splits. J. Brown, I hear ya, but I have to say, as I did on your site too, that ‘achieving’ poses that scared me/I felt I couldn’t do was a HUGE part of the healing yoga gave me. It’s what made me start to feel safe and strong in the world, what made me feel that I was sovereign. And that cannot be overrated.
I don’t really care what brings a person to yoga. The key for me would be the resolve of the teacher/studio to keep true to the art.
Have you ever seen that Namaste yoga show? Gorgeous women lithely sliding from one pose to another. Looks incredibly sexy, has aroused more than one guy I’m sure, but the format!
I have to watch a show or three before I know what’s going on. The progressions happen quickly enough that I’d call it rhythmic gymnastics, not yoga. How are you supposed to open ANYTHING if you spend less than 4 seconds on it?
So I’m fine with people’s perceptions of what yoga is as long as those who are supposed to know better don’t compromise the art in the name of attracting more cash to the studio.
yes it does matter. It’s the end-justifying-the-means fallacy.
I’m one-third the way out of practicing yoga (still regularly, but not as frequently), with no apologies. Not that I was lured by anything but my own interest in it … of course, I did not turn vegan, etc.
Hey Nadine-
Thanks for the shout. I appreciate you picking up the conversation. I think we are in agreement about yoga as porn (EW as you say) but I wonder if there isn’t a bit of hedging going on here. Is Hanumanasana a good idea at all:
http://yogijbrown.com/2010/02/hanumanasana-is-overrated/
“And if the possibility of seeing a girl in yoga pants gets a bloke to yoga class, and then he discovers he actually likes yoga, does it matter what got him there?”
I have been guilty on several occassions of luring my single friends to yoga with the promise of hot yoga girls/guys :-p I try to throw in the real benefits of yoga, the practice of union between the body and mind but unfortunately it generally gets dismissed as “hippie” mumbo jumbo. I guess it’s something that needs to be learnt on the mat, that awareness and realization that the body is an amazing thing, capable of anything you set your mind to do. These friends have stuck to yoga so hopefully something else has struck a chord besides just eye candy
I can’t even remember a time when I couldn’t do the splits. I could do them way before I ever heard the word “yoga”, simply because I did ballet as a kid and my best friend was a gymnast. Our play time as young children included perfecting our splits and handstands (against the wall for me) and so on.
I’ve always kept my splits and so this is not an advanced pose for me. I can perhaps work on hip alignment and lower back positioning, but that’s it. I can even do them without warming up.
BUT rarely do I show my “easy” poses off in class – either ones I’m teaching or where I’m a student. I rarely even demonstrate my full range of motion when teaching, either. What’s the point.
In fact, my students are probably sick of hearing me say how the “middle way” is better, no matter how flexible you are. I often tell them to work where they are stiffest (ahem, in the errr, spine!) and not where they bend easiest. I liken it to wiggling a loose door knob over and over… eventually that door know will fall off if it isn’t stabilised by tightening the screws that hold it in place.
I hear what you’re saying about the reach of sexy yoga pose photos though. But it’s that old chestnut. If that’s all people see, that’s what they’ll believe it’s all about. So its a fine line between drawing people in and education on the heart of yoga, yeah?
when you practice regularly and learn to truly love yourself and your body when it doesn’t look like or do what Briohny Smiths does, that is real yoga. Hanumanasana? A bonus if it happens along the way. The body focused aspect of yoga is one reason why there are so many more injuries being reported now too!
Hey Nadine. I wrote a post relating to a similar question not long back when I came across a picture of a scantily-clad, muscle-bound woman in a balance pose that looked more to me like gymnastics posted on a yoga website. It received a whole heap of comments from ‘yoga’ students about how great she was, how great her body was, how it represented a healthy body. It PISSED me off. I’m thinking about it now and it still pisses me off. Because I have this want that yoga is represented as something that is accessible to everybody and I wonder if seeing these images might actually alienate some people from trying yoga? Can older people relate to these representations of yoga? Can people with illness or disability? Not only that but it’s just so focussed on the body and on nurturing the ego. The hardest classes I find to teach are those filled with students who want a fitness class – I find that if I slow them down, if I make it more gentle and progressive, many won’t come back. Having said all that, I realise these wants are my stuff and it’s not up to me to control how yoga is represented. But if I was all powerful (muahahahahaha) I would represent yoga as the modest, humble, ego-less yet profoundly effective phenomenon that I perceive it to be. ‘If you build it, they will come’ – I’m subscribing to that mantra at the moment, having faith that those who are ready for yoga and who are open to a different way of being will seek it out. Creepy yoga-pervs… I don’t know… it’s an interesting question. Creepy yoga perv probably needs some yoga – maybe a special class for creepy pervs, so as not to violate nice people?
It’s a really had one, isn’t it?
I love looking at pictures of people doing acrobatic yoga stuff, but really, is it yoga? Maybe.
Maybe not.
Yoga for Creepy Pervs eh? Wonder how we’d go with marketing that?
I get the same thing with people not always enjoying my classes. I persist, even though sometimes I feel demoralised. I’ve been at it for a while now, and I think our sort are getting a bit of traction.